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Titan race need help!!!
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talone

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talone

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In TOP-100 only 5 titan players! We should make titan more powerful. So my ideas:

1. increase mobility speeders after attack from 6 to 9
2. radius UV ability of assimilator increase from 5 to 6 or 7
3.time of teleport recharge make 3 rounds
4. increase eclipse mobile to 12 and repair to 3 (now eclipse almost unuseful)

For balance make recharge time of EMP engineer ability of Sap race = 5 raunds.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Apr 11, 2012 07:14


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Cpt Hawaiian

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Cpt Hawaiian

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I agree Titans need something. I think something along the lines of decreasing teleport cooldown to maybe 5-6 turns as well as decreasing engineer EMP to 5-6 as well would be good.

I have some other ideas for them though that I think will be great in the way of new units. I think that because they are mainly defensive and turtling in nature, the correct thing would be to give them attack and pressure options that also lower their turtling ability as a tradeoff. I will post my titan ideas soon.

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StarryBlink

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StarryBlink

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But I think titan already too strong against sapien.
Main disadvantage of titan isn't it's weakness, but its incapable
to play in some maps like jungle or starvation.
While in some maps titan are extremely strong, like peninsular, thermophyllae etc.

I can play well when I pick titan, after I select the compatible maps.
The main reasons I don't like titan is its too defensive&boring.
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talone

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talone

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my ideas almost not make titan stronger against sap, only against khral

Speeder modification not give titan advantage against marauders because speeder need at least 12 mobility after attack to go from marauders contrattack.
With eclipse the same story, it can be easy killed by marauders.
So with Sap all will be good, Sap my favorite race and i know what i say about.

I strongly against changing parametrs of attack or defence, titan already have enough it.

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Cpt Hawaiian

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Cpt Hawaiian

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I think the recent speed buff to speeders is good enough. Increasing the speeder retreat range to 9 seems to be a bit too much, especially on small tactical maps where retreat to base cover would now be too easy. Even a helicopter must be adjacent to a base to retreat on top of it (to cover it), and I think that should be the same for a speeder. So even 7 would be too much for that, I think.

Eclipse seems like it needs something, but I can't figure out what yet.

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talone

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talone

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  Cpt Hawaiian wrote: I think the recent speed buff to speeders is good enough. Increasing the speeder retreat range to 9 seems to be a bit too much, especially on small tactical maps where retreat to base cover would now be too easy. Even a helicopter must be adjacent to a base to retreat on top of it (to cover it), and I think that should be the same for a speeder. So even 7 would be too much for that, I think.

Eclipse seems like it needs something, but I can't figure out what yet.

marauders have 24 mobility with TWO attack!
swarmer is flying cheat
speeder is too weak. If we will do 9 mobility after attack for it, it will have 25 mobility (16 +9) with only one attack.

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waxoid

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waxoid

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I've come around some on this topic , I support these. Increasing speeder move-after is just consistent with the previous mobility increase, and better completes speeder role as helping offset the terrain disadvantages of Titans. Don't care if they can move to base, exactly the kind of thing Titans needs to be less helpless in the presence of terrain or having too many bases to cover. People will have to be more careful leaving bases open with speeders around, but as Talone says still less than what you currently have to consider with marauders.

Increasing eclipse mobility in the same vein, 12 plus range of 2 is quite a reach, but then significant changes are needed vs. khral and vs. sapien eclipse is often a pretty questionable purchase in any case (in 1-1 matches where Sap usually has little incentive to build heli)... it would make a difference on forest heavy maps, as eclipse could now move 2 and that's where you currently see more helis vs. Titans. Seems okay, they'll still have -3 freakin' defense on forest. Healing buff is good, currently as soon as a single ant pops on them or they get a wyrm hit they're essentially done for the match because the khral onslaught is on. +3 feels painful from a precedent perspective but not a balance perspective, certainly vs. khral. Vs. sap, going to +3 starts really making them a more interesting weapon (they can do 2 free damage to tanks following a plasma hit, after all.)
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waxoid

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waxoid

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other things we've kicked around before.
- the old standby: make UV work against buried underlings. Rename it if necessary ("Neutron Pulse"? … Titan tech advance).
- make stomp damage vary randomly between 1 and 2. Or heavy tanks always do 2. anything helps.
- assimilator mobility to 7. Possibly increase assimilator defense to 1 (no 1-hit by wyrm on plains. Titans are tougher, their healer could be a tiny bit tougher too...)
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lantry

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lantry

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I don't think hitting buried units with the UV would really be that much of a help. I do like the idea of giving assimilators better defense, but what I think would really do it would be to have teleported mechas available the turn after teleporting. Right now, teleport rushing isn't a very viable strategy as it allows your opponents two turns to respond. If the teleported units became active at the beginning of your next turn, you would be able to use them much more aggressively.
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Cpt Hawaiian

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Cpt Hawaiian

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I suppose if I get to test the speeder retreat buff I might grow to like it, but off the top of my head it sounds too powerful. I do like the idea of the assimilator movement increase and defensive buff. They don't seem to steal enough underlings these days.

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Cpt Hawaiian

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Cpt Hawaiian

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Ok, here is my idea for a new unit for the titans that would help out. Not sure how much it would cost, but it would add A LOT more strategies for Titans other than just turtling, and it would allow them to create offense at the expense of some defense to be fair.

My idea for the Titans is a flying support unit that greatly enhances the Titan's ability to do things. It has several energy-based abilities. (my idea is to have the unit possess a maximum of 7 energy points, and refill 1 energy per turn. Each special ability costs a certain amount of energy points. The current energy available is visible to all players and show up as a colored number directly on the unit.)

Abilities:
Force field - It can create temporary forcefields that block opponents (forcefields fill one empty tile and can be taken down with one hit from anything and only last for 1-2 turns).

Deep Scan - This targets a circle of 7 hexes and allows any unit that warps into one of these hexes to only have 1 turn of cooldown before they can attack and move again. Another little bonus of Deep Scan is it reveals buried units (important for large open spaces so titans can move into large open positions without chance of buried underlings coming into play)

Lock Down - This ability completely shuts down an enemy's base from being able to create units for one turn.

Explode - The unit can self destruct at-will for significant attack damage to any adjacent non-titan unit. When it is killed it will also explode automatically (if it possesses enough energy), hence, to kill it you want to use range if possible, otherwise you risk losing your attacker as well. The idea behind this is if you have the maximum of 7 energy, you may move in closer to dangerous enemy positions and perform deep scan or lock down and at least have some retribution if the enemy can get to you. If you are low on energy, say at 4 or 5, you may still move in and perform lock down or deep scan but you won't have explosive retribution if you are caught.
 
Again, these abilities all cost energy points though, so they will not be able to be used in rapid succession but will require time to replenish these abilities.

And with TWO of these support units, you could potentially deep scan an area around a base, lock it down, and warp in to have a serious assault! (it's not overpowered because you should be able to see this move coming from a mile away)

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talone

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talone

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new units is very risky for balance. It is work for future. But we must reform titan NOW! Nobody from top plays titan (3%), it is catastrophe!
Friends, i just get by talone2 2900 only by random games with random race. I know this game and balance VERY much. So i ask moderators to ask Xavi to realize my ideas about titan, especially with speeder. TITAN NEED HELP!

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StarryBlink

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StarryBlink

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Here's my suggestion for fine tuning uniwar :


Titan
assimilator - increase its defence to 1 and make UV hit buried ants.
eclipse - increase mobility from 10 to 12,increase ground light attack from 10 to 11,
and increase its ground heavy attack from 4 to 5 (marauder has 4).
But decrease eclipse aerial attack from 12 to 10.
Then eclipse should be more useful against ground units but not extremely strong against aerials.

Sapien
Battery - increase its range from 3-4 to 2-4. Today it has too tiny range to be called artillery.
Engineer - increase its mobility from 6 to 7, and reduce EMP cooldown time to 6 turn.

Kharlean (the overall strongest race today)
Pinzer - increase its aerial attack from 1 to 3 (like marine). Then it should make 1hp damage to copter in normal terrain.

They're easy to implement, and Uniwar will move a little closer to perfect balance.

About titan style is too defensive and turtling, I think it isn't a problem.
People are difference. Someone like defensive style - pick titan.
While the other like offensive style - pick sap or kharl.
If you make titan more offensive but expense its defence, it will be identical to sapien.

I think titan is strong already, I just don't pick them because I don't like its style.
Although kharl is the strongest race in my opinion, I still pick sap because I like sapien's gentleman style of battle.

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Cpt Hawaiian

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Cpt Hawaiian

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I agree that Titans need help. Eclipse speed buff to 12 would be nice, and even ground light to up to 11 attack would be nice to allow them more use as anti-infantry. I would even leave them at 12 anti-air.

The speeder thing, I dunno, I am open to play-testing that. I tell you, having retreat of 9 would be so fun and would definitely open up new strategies for Titans. I guess it should be play-tested.

Being that Titans are so low in ladders does say something, though. I actually like the idea of 5-6 turn cooldown for warping, except that titan vs. titan might potentially slog more in maps like hurtgen and forest walk. Playtesting would provide the answer to that.

That's why I am all for uber high credit units that move the match forward when endless-turtling happens.

In any event, I will talk with devs to at least get their opinions on all this titan balance.

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talone

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talone

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We need Xavi in this topic. Moderators, call him please.

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