re-engineering the EMP

Recent

Hottest

Forum Index » New Feature Request
◄ 1 2 Go Go to page...

Author

Message

Jul 19, 2009 15:23

Subject: Re:re-engineering the EMP

sunnyohno

Messages: 4,
Joined: Jun 28, 2009,
Offline

I have nothing constructive to say, other then...

lol

Jul 19, 2009 16:17

Subject: Re:re-engineering the EMP

Kevor

Messages: 38,
Joined: Jun 14, 2009,
Offline

sunnyohno wrote: I have nothing constructive to say, other then...

lol

wow, that looks so familiar...

(Are you the one that did that to me?? You should be ashamed of yourself...

)

No battle plan survives contact with the enemy...
(Helmuth von Moltke, Generalfeldmarschall of the Prussian Army)

Jul 20, 2009 15:35

Subject: re-engineering the EMP

IzzyNobre

Messages: 35,
Joined: Jun 17, 2009,
Offline

Instead of nerfing the Engineer, perhaps taking a second look at the Helicopter will be more effective in bringing Sapiens players down a notch. As it is, even with the recent nerf, the Helos are still just too damn strong.

I made a thread about it, make sure to voice your opinion

PS: Sup Kevor

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jul 20, 2009 15:39

Jul 20, 2009 16:35

Subject: re-engineering the EMP

Anonymous

don't forget also that the marauder is the only one that can kill a troop capturing a base with 2 consecutive attacks in a single round. not to mention their crazy range so they can block their opponents from reaching bases. add the super strong heli defense and engineer spam, and sapiens have it so easy in this game.

Aug 01, 2009 18:30

Subject: Re:re-engineering the EMP

The Dogalyst

Messages: 22,
Joined: Jul 13, 2009,
Offline

There was one more idea on the other thread, which I happen to like very much:

12) Assimilators provide an EMP protection umbrella to Titan units around it.

What is really cool about this idea is that it adds another strategy factor to the game, and strategy is what this game is about. Not sure whether the umbrella radius should one or two cells.

Aug 02, 2009 23:55

Subject: Re:re-engineering the EMP

Unimarobj

Messages: 43,
Joined: Jun 15, 2009,
Offline

meh...i don't really think the assimilator could do such a think. Aren't EMP shields made from certain fibers or alloys? If it's an energy function, the EMP would just shut it down. I really think the best change would be a choice between move OR EMP.
Not both.

Not trying to bash ya Dogalyst, just saying.

Aug 04, 2009 08:28

Subject: Re:re-engineering the EMP

Kevor

Messages: 38,
Joined: Jun 14, 2009,
Offline

Good save, Dogalyst! I missed that one. Like Unimarobj, I kind of wonder what it might do to gameplay. But I think its a cool idea! Its on the list, which now reads:

(1) Make the engineer unable to move on the same turn as they do an EMP
(2) Lower the engineer's defense, so they are easier to kill
(NOTE: as mentioned, engineers already have Defense Strength = 0. Would have to start them with <10 hit points to make easier to kill.)
(3) The effect of the EMP would be to immobilize Titan units, but they can still attack and defend.
(4) The effect of the EMP would be to immobilize Titan units, but they can still defend.
(5) The effect of the EMP would be to slow Titan units (e.g. halving their movement)
(6) After a Titan unit recovers from EMP, it is immune to EMP for the next 1 or 2 rounds
(7) Make engineers "cooldown" after using EMP for a turn or two
(NOTE: by 'cooldown', not referring to the EMP, which already has a 10-turn cooldown, but to the engineer being able to move, reprogram, etc.)
(8 ) EMP only affects 1 space around the engineer, instead of 2.
(9) Engineers get no terrain bonus.
(10) Engineers with less than 5 (or X) health cannot EMP.
(11) EMP shuts the Titans down for the Sapien's round (when the EMP was fired), but not the for Titan's next round.
(12) Assimilators provide an EMP protection umbrella to Titan units immediately around it (1 hex range)

(Sorry for not being around so much, work has been a bitch lately...)

No battle plan survives contact with the enemy...
(Helmuth von Moltke, Generalfeldmarschall of the Prussian Army)

Aug 04, 2009 08:38

Subject: Re:re-engineering the EMP

Kevor

Messages: 38,
Joined: Jun 14, 2009,
Offline

OK, that said, I am going to weigh in on the choices we have on the list:

(1) Make the engineer unable to move on the same turn as they do an EMP
I still think this is the simplest fix, and the best one to try.

(2) Lower the engineer's defense, so they are easier to kill
(NOTE: as mentioned, engineers already have Defense Strength = 0. Would have to start them with <10 hit points to make easier to kill.)
Doing this would make an exception to the game -- every unit now starts with 10 HP. Not worth changing the game that much, unless the designers want to start changing that parameter throughout the game.

(3) The effect of the EMP would be to immobilize Titan units, but they can still attack and defend.
(4) The effect of the EMP would be to immobilize Titan units, but they can still defend.
(5) The effect of the EMP would be to slow Titan units (e.g. halving their movement)
All of these are worth considering, but I don't like them, because I think EMP should be all or nothing. It just doesn't make sense to me that an EMP would knock out a unit's ability to move or attack, but it could still defend and inflict damage. But that's just me – I like some element of realism.

(6) After a Titan unit recovers from EMP, it is immune to EMP for the next 1 or 2 rounds
I do like this one, and it is my second choice after (1). It would definitely stop the 'engineer spam' where a column of titans is stopped dead in their tracks forever while one engineer after another pops up and freezes them. Gets really boring...

(7) Make engineers "cooldown" after using EMP for a turn or two
(NOTE: by 'cooldown', not referring to the EMP, which already has a 10-turn cooldown, but to the engineer being able to move, reprogram, etc.)
I also like this one -- third choice. But I would make it only a 1-turn cooldown.

(8 ) EMP only affects 1 space around the engineer, instead of 2.
This is also OK, but would really lower the impact of EMP. (Which is the point, I know -- but maybe it would lower it too much.)

(9) Engineers get no terrain bonus.
This is a really easy fix, and could be done in addition to any of the choices above. I like it.

(10) Engineers with less than 5 (or X) health cannot EMP.
This would be another exception to the game mechanics -- all the other support units can do their special power even if they have only 1 HP left. So, I do not favor it.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at Aug 04, 2009 08:45

No battle plan survives contact with the enemy...
(Helmuth von Moltke, Generalfeldmarschall of the Prussian Army)

Aug 04, 2009 08:42

Subject: Re:re-engineering the EMP

Kevor

Messages: 38,
Joined: Jun 14, 2009,
Offline

(ran out of space...)

(11) EMP shuts the Titans down for the Sapien's round (when the EMP was fired), but not the for Titan's next round.
This also makes the EMP too weak, in my opinion. Don't like.

(12) Assimilators provide an EMP protection umbrella to Titan units immediately around it (1 hex range)
This is a really interesting idea, but I'd want to see some game testing before I could form an opinion. At this point, I just don't know what effect it would have on the game. (It would make the assimilator a stronger unit, which has been a subject of other threads, so you could solve 2 problems at once.... still, I just don't know...)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Aug 04, 2009 08:46

No battle plan survives contact with the enemy...
(Helmuth von Moltke, Generalfeldmarschall of the Prussian Army)

Aug 05, 2009 16:54

Subject: Re:re-engineering the EMP

Unimarobj

Messages: 43,
Joined: Jun 15, 2009,
Offline

I'm sticking with the move or EMP option.
Buuuuut, I wanna know what Kralux and Rolando and THOSE guys are thinking...
they are kind of the ones with the power here lol.

Hello out there...................

=]

Aug 05, 2009 21:07

Subject: re-engineering the EMP

Anonymous

Move or EMP will make it harder to get the EMP spam started, but it will not stop the EMP spam once it does start.

You simply EMP with one engineer and more the next engineer into place on the same turn. Then repeat forever.

You can simulate this by simply playing a game where you agree not to EMP and move an engineer on the same turn. You will see that EMP spam still happens.

Aug 05, 2009 23:55

Subject: re-engineering the EMP

Anonymous

There's another option, which is to make the engineers cost 300 or 400. Might be appropriate considering their power.

Aug 06, 2009 11:20

Subject: Re:re-engineering the EMP

GameShaman

Messages: 63,
Joined: Jul 13, 2009,
Location: Chicago, IL
Offline

You can't only take into account Sapien vs. Titan when talking about changes. If you simply increase the cost of the Engineer, in a Sapien vs. Khralean matchup, you now have an engineer that can only heal x2 that costs as much or more than a unit that can heal 3x and convert your infantry. So I would suggest that any changes made to EMP simply affect EMP and no other aspects of the Engineer.

Aug 07, 2009 15:05

Subject: re-engineering the EMP

Anonymous

So? Sapiens are still overpowered against khraleans, even if the engineer cost more they'd be the superior race. Hell most sapien vs khralean games are won by sapiens with no engineers used at all.

Anyway there needs to be a simple and easy to implement solution because they're not going to go rework the game, I'm pretty sure the devs are all moving on to other things at this point and we're going to be lucky if they do anything.

Aug 12, 2009 10:44

Subject: re-engineering the EMP

Kevor

Messages: 38,
Joined: Jun 14, 2009,
Offline

Anonymous wrote: So? Sapiens are still overpowered against khraleans, even if the engineer cost more they'd be the superior race. Hell most sapien vs khralean games are won by sapiens with no engineers used at all.

Only against players who don't know how to play Khraleans properly, in my humble opinion... (I beat Sapiens all the time playing the bug, but maybe that's just me...)

Anyway, the real point of this post is that it looks like our work is over! As you've seen by now, the guys at Xpressed have made up their minds, and decided to go with the option of engineers not moving and EMPing on the same turn. I think that our discussion here might well have been an important factor in that, and I thank all of you who participated. So, lets just close this thread out.... 'cause I have the feeling that somebody will start a new one to bitch about the change to the EMP that was made...

Forum Index » New Feature Request
◄ 1 2 Go Go to page...