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Jul 12, 2012 18:40

Subject: Sapien Help

swingfirst

Messages: 2,
Joined: Dec 30, 2010,
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I have noticed a pattern over the last few hundred games played. When it's Sapien VS Titans on many of the newer maps, there is enough money that the Titans throw up a plasma tank, and a few walkers behind it and there is little the sapiens can do. They just do not hit the heavies hard enough and their range is inferior to everyone else in the game. Please, do not tell me that sapient artillery shoots farther than Khraleans, because it doesnt, the khraleans can move, then shoot (max of 5 range total) and the sapiens can shoot max of 4, and they cannot move and shoot.

I believe that giving the Sapiens a new unit, a bazooka solder basically, hits heavy units hard, but does little damage otherwise, at same cost as regular infantry, would be a step in the right direction. Or maybe let helicopters hit tanks harder.

Jul 13, 2012 05:37

Subject: Re:Sapien Help

droidfreak36

Messages: 183,
Joined: Jan 23, 2012,
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If you're fighting Titans with Helis and Marines (which is what it sounds like), you're going about it wrong. Sapiens have a heavy hitter too, the Tank, and while it might lose to the Plasma Tank in attack and defense it is cheaper and heals faster. If the enemy is only guarding his Walkers with one Plasma you may even want to build Marauders to speed around the Plasma and hit the Walkers. Also, never forget that Engineers can EMP to knock out Plasma Tanks, allowing your tanks to attack them without taking damage and letting your marauders move through their zone of control.

DroidFreak, the roboticist who plays as Khrals.

(Or Titans now that I realize how legit they are)

Jul 13, 2012 08:58

Subject: Re:Sapien Help

waxoid

Messages: 442,
Joined: Aug 07, 2010,
Location: Seattle, WA
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There are quite a lot of maps where aggressive sap play can lead to a win, sometimes in surprising situations. In particular there is a lot of depth to marauder play, if you can use marauders to terrorize, steal material (and escape to heal) and pressure walker stand-up you should. Plus perfect balance of engineer, battery, tank, marines, helis...

All that said, on maps where Titans can create a plasma barrier and stand up walkers and defend all bases, there is definitely a recognized balance problem here. We've had a number of threads about it. Some brainstorming going on about what changes to the battery, for example, might help.

Jul 13, 2012 21:08

Subject: Re:Sapien Help

youownme

Messages: 62,
Joined: Feb 05, 2011,
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I'm trying my best to get something done about this.

I have been considering increasing battery cost to 650 and introducing a MOVE after ATTACK of one tile, or a mobility of 5.

Also considering sap tank defense increased one.

Not sure if battery change would eliminate the need for the tank, some testing would have to be done.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jul 13, 2012 21:12

-_-

Jul 18, 2012 11:48

Subject: Re:Sapien Help

regard87

Messages: 97,
Joined: Mar 29, 2012,
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Along with discussions of range and such to bring the battery up to the other units abilities.
Has anyone considered just giving the Battery the highest defense rating of any artillery unit??

Wouldnt change the fact that it has the lowest range but if it was more durable it would sort of make up for the fact that a Walker can outshoot it and allow it to continue hampering Plasma walls, while healing less often and surviving Walker attacks longer. Currently the Walkers defense is 5 and the Battery/Wyrms are at 4. If the Battery was at 6 would that help balance Titan/Sapien battles without throwing Kral/Sapien battles off too much?

Creator of Powerplay, Weakside, Strongside and Gap Control.
Also OddManBreak, IceRink, Breakout2v2

Testing FlyingV, MixNmatch, GatherRoundtheWell Give them a try!

Jul 20, 2012 09:38

Subject: Re:Sapien Help

StarryBlink

Messages: 184,
Joined: Jan 04, 2012,
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regard87 wrote: Along with discussions of range and such to bring the battery up to the other units abilities.
Has anyone considered just giving the Battery the highest defense rating of any artillery unit??

Wouldnt change the fact that it has the lowest range but if it was more durable it would sort of make up for the fact that a Walker can outshoot it and allow it to continue hampering Plasma walls, while healing less often and surviving Walker attacks longer. Currently the Walkers defense is 5 and the Battery/Wyrms are at 4. If the Battery was at 6 would that help balance Titan/Sapien battles without throwing Kral/Sapien battles off too much?

Increase battery defend from 4 to 6 is a good idea too.
Although I still prefer increasing battery range from 3-4 to 2-4.

As a sapien fan, the only sap. thing I want it fixed is battery.
Another sapien units are already doing their job well.

Aug 14, 2012 13:19

Subject: Sapien Help

stormtrooper

Messages: 13,
Joined: Oct 20, 2010,
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In several more Titan / sapien games now. They all go the same. First turn as sapien I build marauders to attack quickly. The field is big so armor is too slow. My Titan enemy builds speeders to counter, and they are tougher than marauders so I must pull back. Now I make a helicopter, and he counters with a plasma tank. He plants the tank between my copter and his base. Next turn his tank steps forward, but it's a big map and my bases are not threatened. Speeders up to flank, and walker is made.

Aug 14, 2012 13:24

Subject: Sapien Help

stormtrooper

Messages: 13,
Joined: Oct 20, 2010,
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After walker is made, game becomes slow buildup that sapien will eventually lose.

But no worries. I am titans on several maps and I punished their marauders too, killing two so far with no losses. I understand the pattern now. Sapien forces MUST fight recklessly against titans. There is no hope for my sapien enemies, we will see how my own sapien armies fare, and who knows? Maybe my Titan enemies will lose. It's certainly their game to win or lose.

Aug 17, 2012 13:06

Subject: Re:Sapien Help

regard87

Messages: 97,
Joined: Mar 29, 2012,
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On small maps like Chato Hill I do well as a Sap vs Titans, always building far more engineers than some might think neccessary so I have a constant supply of EMPs and can bring Tanks to full health from the brink of death.

On a larger map if theres a good amount of money and some chokeholds you only have a couple rounds to wreak havoc, if the Titan walls in it can be over already.

Creator of Powerplay, Weakside, Strongside and Gap Control.
Also OddManBreak, IceRink, Breakout2v2

Testing FlyingV, MixNmatch, GatherRoundtheWell Give them a try!

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