Gang-Up bonus question

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Apr 17, 2013 05:38

Subject: Gang-Up bonus question

mdusoe

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Joined: Apr 17, 2013,
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Why does the gang-up bonus not really gang up?

It appears that the bonus only takes into account the last attack made on an enemy, not an accumulation of all attacks. The extreme example is when there are 5 battery hits, each of which granting +1 gang-up bonus, the ensuing marine attack should, imho, gain a +5 bonus. However, it seems (both by experience and forum confirmation) that the bonus is only +1.

I understand that this may just be the way it is, and I will adjust strategy to compensate (probably not successfully

). I have recently come over from Weewar. Uniwar seems to have taken the battle math calculations from Weewar (see links below), which I think was very smart. I am curious as to the reason the gang-up bonus was changed.

For some maps, the "swarm" technique of lots of little units can be quite effective, but only when 3rd, 4th, 5th etc. attacks begin to get really large bonuses. This does not seem to be as effective here.

http://www.uniwar.com/forum/posts/list/1354.page
http://weewar.com/specifications

Again, I am not complaining, and I will adjust. I am just looking for someone to a) confirm that my understanding is correct, and b) maybe start a discussion as to the history and merits of each approach.

Thanks.
Mike.

Apr 17, 2013 08:23

Subject: Re:Gang-Up bonus question

simsverd

Messages: 921,
Joined: Dec 02, 2010,
Location: Bergen, Norway
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Welcome to uniwar

I dont think uniwar is a "fork" from weewar. I think the battle calculation is the same that is used in many such games as well as the method of point distribution (ELO formula).

The gangup works as you describe: only related to the prewious attack. I dont know why the devs wanted it to work like that and not accumulative... but i think it would be a very big change to rewrite it so i would not expect a change here any time soon...

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Apr 17, 2013 09:07

Subject: Re:Gang-Up bonus question

mdusoe

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Joined: Apr 17, 2013,
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I wasn't thinking it would be changed, only curious to know why.

My son and I actually made a board game version of Weewar that we play. We calculate the target number (p, in the formula) the same way as weewar, then roll d20s to determine damage. Any d20 under the "p" counts as a hit. It is definitely more volatile, but we didn't want to roll 60 d20s for a full health unit. 10 is plenty...

It is pretty fun, although a bit complicated... turns out computers do math a lot better than we do

Anyway, this is why that math is ingrained into my head so firmly

Apr 17, 2013 10:22

Subject: Re:Gang-Up bonus question

waxoid

Messages: 442,
Joined: Aug 07, 2010,
Location: Seattle, WA
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Not familiar with weewar, but I'm a big fan of the uniwar gang-up (and zone of control) system which I think is core to the great combination of tactical and strategic gameplay. You of course get more gang-up when attacking from different sides so it makes positioning important. Cumulative gang-up would seem to encourage more swarm/spam style of play (lots of cheaper units) vs. the balanced set of units most uniwar match-ups call for, which I like. I guess, play it for awhile, get good and see if the feeling still holds.

How well does weewar hold up to expert level play? Is there just one set of units for all? Not sure I can get past the graphics.

Apr 17, 2013 10:34

Subject: Re:Gang-Up bonus question

mdusoe

Messages: 4,
Joined: Apr 17, 2013,
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I can't say it is any better or worse from a gameplay perspective --- just different. Yes, both sides play from the same pool of units. The gang-up accumulation is balanced by the unit costs. For example, small infantry are only 75 credits, but a tank is 300. It might take 3 or 4 inf to kill a tank, each taking less damage than the last, but without the accumulation, it would take 5 or 6 inf to do the same thing.

Just different is all.

Proportionately, there are just as many experts there as there are here. I would probably favor weewar given a choice, but only for the same reason I can't teach my son how to multiply numbers in the new way - familiarity.

Change is good, though. It stretches the mind. I am sure I will get used to these mechanics.

Apr 17, 2013 10:52

Subject: Re:Gang-Up bonus question

waxoid

Messages: 442,
Joined: Aug 07, 2010,
Location: Seattle, WA
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I'm more interested in how the balance plays out at expert levels - tendency to stalemate or standoffs? Map factors tend to dictate winner? Or the game is balanced enough that the gameplay will advance and resolve in good time and the better player will win? Does the game inventively present continual new tactical and strategic challenges as new games unfold?

Of course one big attraction of uniwar here is the multi-race element, which means you've got 6 main race strategies to master (SvT, TvS, SvK etc... 9 if you count same race). Some maps/matchups work better relative to the above criteria than others, and balance is a work in continual progress.

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