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altchess

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altchess

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Hi all.
My english is not perfect, but hopefully understandable.
I am against undo of whole turn in online games, as i belive discussion is here about. In online chess there's no undo. Board in uniwar is more complicated, but undo move of unit just used is enough for me.
As for payment for keeping developers alive & active
In online chess i saw ads, paid subscription. In BBO, U buy coins, for fee in tournaments, where U can win some more coins.
Whatever U'll do, please don't make this game pay2win.

PS Undo of whole turn is useful in offline games. It's like saves in game.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Apr 01, 2016 07:40

amidama

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amidama

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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jul 17, 2016 22:37


Hakumen
EVR1022

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EVR1022

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  nindatana wrote:Having a delay each time free-undo is used is interesting and bears exploring. Personally i'd go seconds to minutes though, not hours.

A set number of free undo per day is also interesting, and to my mind more attractive than per use delay. Of course they could both be used at same time.

However neither suggestion address the fundamental imbalance, that haves and have-nots unlevels the playing field. They would make the imbalance more palatable, but not fix it.


I think both suggestions address it. It levels the playing field in any individual game, since undo would be available (either by delay or a certain # per day). Now, if you want to undo lots of times, then you pay for it. Just like you would pay if you want more game slots, or bigger archives. You can play a small number of games at a level playing field with anyone. If you want to play more and remain competitive, then support the devs!

Sidenote - I know players that have reached 2300 w/o undo. Few players are above 2600 even with undo. It has an impact, but it's not the huge impact that some are implying. I'm pretty sure I'd consistently beat a 2000-2100 that's using undo without using it myself. It matters, but tactics and strategy matter far more.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Apr 01, 2016 15:14

amidama

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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jul 17, 2016 22:37


Hakumen
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simsverd

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simsverd

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  amidama wrote:
  EVR1022 wrote:
Sidenote - I know players that have reached 2300 w/o undo. Few players are above 2600. It has an impact, but it's not the huge impact that some are implying. I'm pretty sure I'd consistently beat a 2000-2100 that's using undo without using it myself. It matters, but tactics and strategy matter far more.


lier.


warning. do that again and i will block your access to write posts on the forum temporarely

Moderator of gamechat and forum. Tourney admin.

Send me a PM here or invite me to a game if you want to ask me something, suggest a map for tourney or just wanna play a game
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amidama

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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jul 17, 2016 22:38


Hakumen
EVR1022

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EVR1022

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  amidama wrote:I can try to translate it to polite english
"i find your statment to be very, very unlikely and would want to see any kind of proofs that you may use to back up your statment. Im so sure that your statment isnt correct that i can bet against it."


Which part? My teammate in 2v2 has never used undo, and he's been 2200-2300 for ages.

And if you'd like to test the other part, invite me to a game.
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Mentalist

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Mentalist

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I can't help but appreciate the dilemma Xavi is facing. Free undo encourages multi account, actually its a requirement. So less people will buy the undo button and less people will buy extra slots. But if they take it away, it will impact the fairness of the game. And I take into account the best scenario which is that it won't affect the game that much. Even so, it will affect it. If it goes free may god help Xavi. People already complain about the most insignificant things, I KNOW people will be asking for a refund. Even if the shop clearly states that there would be none, Xavi already did it once, that creates expectations so i don't think he should have done it. That's it. I'm just contemplating this whole problem and thanking the god I don't believe in for not being in Xavi's shoes right now
amidama

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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jul 17, 2016 22:38


Hakumen
EVR1022

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EVR1022

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  amidama wrote:
  EVR1022 wrote:
  amidama wrote:I can try to translate it to polite english
"i find your statment to be very, very unlikely and would want to see any kind of proofs that you may use to back up your statment. Im so sure that your statment isnt correct that i can bet against it."


Which part? My teammate in 2v2 has never used undo, and he's been 2200-2300 for ages.

And if you'd like to test the other part, invite me to a game.

but you already have the unlimited undo button.
i guess my 2100-ish score is enough to have a significant chance to win against you.
but how can i be sure that you are not using the undo?


You could take my word for it, or I can use my alternate account (EVR1022-S) for which I haven't purchased the undo button. Technically I could still log in / log out, but I won't. And I'll commentate my reasoning for each move, so you can see how I made my decisions.

It'd be an interesting experiment. I would like to refine my estimate of how much of a rating gap the undo button can make up for. Back it up with some data instead of just guessing.

You can pick any map you'd like, but I'd like a mirror for whatever map / race matchup we end up with. We can do 2-3 different maps/race match ups if you'd like.
amidama

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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jul 17, 2016 22:39


Hakumen
EVR1022

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EVR1022

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I'm willing to test however you'd like, but that match up seems to favor K even with undo. Maybe a tournament map like 'Battering Boats'? It's big, but T can at least go after bases. If it's too spread out they have no chance. In general, I'd favor tournament maps, or at least rated maps that are well-regarded.

Anyhow, I guess it doesn't matter too much if we do mirror. Then we can just compare turns to victory if match up is unbalanced.

I hate KvK, so if that's not on your list it's fine by me

I think a separate topic would be a good idea for this.
Phill_the_ll

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Phill_the_ll

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First of all, I would like to thank the devs for creating such an awesome game. And because I like it so much, I would hare for the devs To make a mistake.

Here are my 2 cents: please do not get rid of 'free undo'! IMO, that is what keeps 'unlimited undo' from being pay-to-win. It has already been established how 'unlimited undo' has an advantage over people who don't have it. Especially when it OS abused to view past FOW, and worse if the Luther player cannot even 'free undo' his misscklick.
Anyways, on to the solution! Personally, I like nindatana's idea where of one player has 'unlimited undo', then his opponent will also have it for the game. This will create an even playing field, while still providing support toward the devs. If this where to be implemented, I would buy 'unlimited undo' immediately.

PS. @EVR1022: I appreciate your liking of my map
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Apercent

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Apercent

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A half way solution: this is a possible compromise between no paid undo and for paid undo. How about we make undos more expensive (like 5 unicoins), and get rid of unlimited? Perhaps, we can give players something that makes undo cheaper (back to 3 unicoins). Instead. Or better yet, just make unlimited undo something that gives players a daily wage of unicoins(maybe 20 a day?) And raise its cost to 19.99. Or perhaps something that gives players a weekly wage of undos. But giving them all unlimited at once seems too easy to spam.

This is either going to make everyone mad or everyone happy. It's not a solution just a suggestion.

And as for the weekly wage idea, idk, maybe 20 a week? We just don't want it to become spammable. 20 a week is Hardy to spam than infinity everyday, AND it makes you more money.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Apr 01, 2016 21:20

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cmbaptist

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cmbaptist

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That's an easy stance to take apercent.... In that you yourself have not purchased any unicoins.

Psalms 100:5 For the Lord is good; his mercy is everlasting; and his truth endureth to all generations.
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