Xenai
Messages: 40,
Joined: Oct 06, 2010,
Offline
|
|
Xenai
Messages: 40,
Joined: Oct 06, 2010,
Offline
|
I believe the next big update is planned to contain a big map overhaul, so I think it would be useful to come up with a list that of maps that are generally agreed to be playable. Playable defined as being able to host with at least 1 race and not be guaranteed a loss if your opponent picks one of the other 2 races and is the same skill level as you are. (So for example, Dead Monk would not be a playable map because hosting as Khral gets beaten by Sap, hosting as Sap gets beaten by Titan, and hosting as Titan gets beaten by Khral.) Keep in mind that I'm only listing maps I have experience with, so there definitely will be ones that are playable but not included in this initial list.
In Current Form
Piriapolis
Hurtgen Forest
Forest Walk
Desolate
Gold Rush
Laguna Niguel
With Small Modifications
Chato Hill - Change starting unit placement so blue and red take the same number of rounds to cap their bases.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at Nov 30, 2010 13:59
|
|
|
![[Avatar]](/images/avatar/d9731321ef4e063ebbee79298fa36f56.jpg)
nfong
Messages: 576,
Joined: Mar 07, 2010,
Location: where it's fun
Offline
|
|
nfong
Messages: 576,
Joined: Mar 07, 2010,
Location: where it's fun
Offline
|
All of those maps are unbalanced, I believe. 
Piriapolis is nearly impossible to beat titans with saps.
Titans can't beat any other race on Jungle.
Hurtgen Forest is quite hard to win with titans.
Same for Forest Walk and Desolate.
Saps can beat krahl and titan on Gold Rush. The map isn't big enough for a krahl player or a titan player.
|
When life gives you lemons...
"TAKE YOUR DAMN LEMONS BACK, LIFE. I DON'T WANT YOUR STINKIN' LEMONS." |
|
|
Xenai
Messages: 40,
Joined: Oct 06, 2010,
Offline
|
|
Xenai
Messages: 40,
Joined: Oct 06, 2010,
Offline
|
Yes but by that definition of balance (where every race has an even chance) every single map is unbalanced. These ones at least you can host with at least 1 race without being guaranteed a loss if your opponent counter-picks.
|
|
|
Solitary
Messages: 273,
Joined: Aug 24, 2010,
Offline
|
|
Solitary
Messages: 273,
Joined: Aug 24, 2010,
Offline
|
Nfong, I'd have to disagree with most of that >.<.
Jungle is unbalanced in lots of ways though, even down to being host favoured when playing same race matchups.
I have a winning record khral against sapiens on gold rush xD. Hurtgen forest titans are advantaged against sapiens slightly although not as extreme as on forest walk so I think the map is okay on average. I've not tried gold rush vs sapiens as red khral though (only blue) so if you'd like to show me why you think it's unbalanced then send an invite as sapiens to my Isolation account, nfong . I'll play you on hurtgen forest as titans vs your sapiens as well if you like as I'm sure sapiens aren't advantaged in that matchup.
Montevideo I'd add to the list of maps I think are balanced (or at least with small modifications) as well as chato hill also with some small modifications.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Nov 23, 2010 11:55
|
|
|
nfong
Messages: 576,
Joined: Mar 07, 2010,
Location: where it's fun
Offline
|
|
nfong
Messages: 576,
Joined: Mar 07, 2010,
Location: where it's fun
Offline
|
Actually, yes I agree about Hurtgen Forest. My bad.  I'm willing to play you gold rush though.
Montevideo needs some balancing though...iluvkim plays that map as krahls all the time against titans
|
When life gives you lemons...
"TAKE YOUR DAMN LEMONS BACK, LIFE. I DON'T WANT YOUR STINKIN' LEMONS." |
|
|
Xenai
Messages: 40,
Joined: Oct 06, 2010,
Offline
|
|
Xenai
Messages: 40,
Joined: Oct 06, 2010,
Offline
|
Removed Jungle and added a "with small modifications" section with Chato Hill. Solitary, how would you propose balancing Montevideo? Also, I think you could do a fairly effective fix to Dead Monk by adding an extra row of plains tiles on each side of the forest. For Khral vs. Sap, it would give Khrals more room where their front line can't be hit by a copter straight off a base and lessen the impact of a copter which hit-and-runs back into the forest tiles. For Sap vs. Titan, it would make walkers a bit less powerful and give batteries more room to maneuver. For Khral vs. Titan, it would slow the rate the Khral could pour ninjalings into Titan territory.
|
|
|
Isolation
Messages: 24,
Joined: Nov 15, 2010,
Offline
|
|
Isolation
Messages: 24,
Joined: Nov 15, 2010,
Offline
|
I'd also remove some terrain from chato hill as the terrain stops you being able to move wyrms around with khral. The tiles nearest the corner bases on chato hill I'd reduce down to only one tile I think although I'd need to look into that a bit closer. Montevideo I'm not sure about yet as I have no idea how iluvkim gets all his wins khral against titan. I've had a couple of lucky games on there, a couple of wins, and about to pick up another loss against titans unless my opponent makes a mistake. Dead Monk I'd probably extend outwards so there's a two tile gap between the lower base and the forest, swap the top forest tile for a desert and increase the credits/base to 150 (which would need playtesting obviously).
I'm interested to see the gold rush game nfong as I've wiped out some strong players there quite comfortably with khral against saps xD.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Nov 23, 2010 21:31
|
|
|
cochise
Messages: 6,
Joined: Nov 25, 2010,
Offline
|
|
cochise
Messages: 6,
Joined: Nov 25, 2010,
Offline
|
Solitary wrote: Jungle is unbalanced in lots of ways though, even down to being host favoured when playing same race matchups.
Disagree on that statement.... invite me if you want, and I attempt to show you... Agree Titans no good, although in my opinion both host and joiner have same chance, all depends on your strategy, and counter strategies.
|
|
|
Solitary
Messages: 273,
Joined: Aug 24, 2010,
Offline
|
|
Solitary
Messages: 273,
Joined: Aug 24, 2010,
Offline
|
Invite sent, not that experienced on jungle but if I lose as blue sapiens it will be the first time xD. I hate that map!
|
|
|
![[Avatar]](/images/avatar/14d9e8007c9b41f57891c48e07c23f57.png)
Nicko
Messages: 430,
Joined: Mar 07, 2010,
Location: Breda, The Netherlands
Offline
|
|
Nicko
Messages: 430,
Joined: Mar 07, 2010,
Location: Breda, The Netherlands
Offline
|
Great wall, Wildplains, Goldrush, Laguna Niguel... All of those maps shouldn't be modified, they're already pretty much balanced.
If you never win against a certain setting on those maps, then you're just a noob who doesn't change tactics and never "evolves".
|
"I hate the world's population, it's too large and getting larger. People need to slow down on the sex!"
-00101101
Wandering... |
|
|
Solitary
Messages: 273,
Joined: Aug 24, 2010,
Offline
|
|
Solitary
Messages: 273,
Joined: Aug 24, 2010,
Offline
|
I don't think you can win laguna nigual with khrals against saps although feel free to prove me wrong on that xD. It's especially bad with red khrals as the helicopter is out earlier and it's harder to get your units in position to defend.
|
|
|
Hachiman
Messages: 118,
Joined: Jun 25, 2009,
Offline
|
|
Hachiman
Messages: 118,
Joined: Jun 25, 2009,
Offline
|
Nicko I believe host Saps or Khrals (and probably Titans too) can always be defeated by red Titans on Wildplains.
Or at least I've always won with them, over many games, and I don't know a counter.
|
|
|
![[Avatar]](/images/avatar/36d7534290610d9b7e9abed244dd2f28.jpg)
Nixflix
Messages: 238,
Joined: Apr 09, 2010,
Location: j
Offline
|
|
Nixflix
Messages: 238,
Joined: Apr 09, 2010,
Location: j
Offline
|
Solitary wrote: I don't think you can win laguna nigual with khrals against saps although feel free to prove me wrong on that xD. It's especially bad with red khrals as the helicopter is out earlier and it's harder to get your units in position to defend.
You sure?
I've beat one or two players who are in the 2,000s for score on that map with me as khraleans and and them as blue sapiens, but if what you're saying is true then it may have been because of their mistakes
By the time they have one heli you have enough for two garudas though. And as red khraleans, you also get a credit boost, right?
|
Sorry if i offended you |
|
|
nfong
Messages: 576,
Joined: Mar 07, 2010,
Location: where it's fun
Offline
|
|
nfong
Messages: 576,
Joined: Mar 07, 2010,
Location: where it's fun
Offline
|
I think deadmonk would also be a good map with small modifications.
I'm working on a titan vs krahl strategy though >:3
Xenai wrote:
Chato Hill - Change starting unit placement so blue and red take the same number of rounds to cap their bases.
Wow I just noticed that xD
Next time I can go on uniwar, I'll let xavi know about that :3
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Nov 28, 2010 20:20
|
When life gives you lemons...
"TAKE YOUR DAMN LEMONS BACK, LIFE. I DON'T WANT YOUR STINKIN' LEMONS." |
|
|
Solitary
Messages: 273,
Joined: Aug 24, 2010,
Offline
|
|
Solitary
Messages: 273,
Joined: Aug 24, 2010,
Offline
|
Yea Nix, it's mostly to do with proximity and too much terrain I believe. Even 2000+ players seem to make hundreds of really basic mistakes on maps they aren't used to xD. I can send you invite unrated if you like, I just think marine spam is too hard to counter as khral on that map because the starting bases are in range of each other by helicopter which means you can't make underlings in them after like turn one. If there was a bit less terrain it might be playable but I haven't found a way to stop a quick push!
|
|
|
|
|
![[Search]](/templates/default/images/icon_mini_search.gif){kind=icon}
![[Recent Topics]](/templates/default/images/icon_mini_recentTopics.gif){kind=icon}
![[Login]](/templates/default/images/icon_mini_login.gif){kind=icon}
Login
![[Post New]](/templates/default/images/icon_minipost_new.gif){kind=icon}
![[Up]](/templates/default/images/icon_up.gif){kind=icon}
