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unfair advantage for second player?
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ddeeaann

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ddeeaann

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Start a two player game on Chato Hill, make p1 the Titans, and p2 the Khraleans. Notice the inequality of the starting resources:

p1 (titans): 1 base, 500 credits, 2 mechas close enough to only capture 1 additional base
p2 (Khraleans): 1 base, 600 credits, 2 underlings adjacent to two unclaimed bases

That's an unfair advantage! The second player starts with an extra 100 points and is poised to be in control of 3 bases after the first turn. Try reversing the players/armies:

p1 (Khraleans): 1 base, 500 bases, 2 underlings close enough to only capture 1 additional base
p2 (titans): 1 base, 600 credits, 2 mechas adjacent to two unclaimed bases

In this case also, the second player has an unfair advantage of more credits and more first turn bases.

Has anyone noticed similar inequalities on other boards, or with other armies? I hope not! Otherwise why ever start a game if the second player has an advantage?
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jeffrey

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jeffrey

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Its intentional that the second player gets a little more credits. This was done to help that fact that player one usually has an advantage over player two in being able to move first. As for Khralean units being able to move far and capture bases faster, that's part of the advantage of their race and is factored into game balance.
5200

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5200

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One player or the other has a big advantage on a lot of maps. The first player on Montevideo or Desolate for example can completely dominate the game. That's why I think the 1st/2nd player slots should always be randomized.

However, I'd also say that Titans are slower to capture their first bases on many maps, not just this one, and Khraleans can capture first bases faster than even sapiens on other maps. That's intentional, Titans are meant to be slow (but powerful), Khraeleans to be quick but weak and disposable.
ddeeaann

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ddeeaann

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It's not just about the speed of the Khraleans- the second player's starting units are literally adjacent to the unoccupied bases, whereas the first player has to move to get there. The placement of initial units is the same for any race. The effect is that no matter what race you use, the second player starts not only with more credits, but also much better position to capture bases.

I'm not sure I agree that the first move has much of an advantage on this board- you really cant do much besides capture a base. No matter what races are chosen, by the end of turn two the second player will have many more credits than the first player due to the initial unit placements.

The game really needs some randomization (of boards or player spots) to account for this imbalance.

Otherwise it's totally awesome- I play it every single day, a great, fun game and app!
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IzzyNobre

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IzzyNobre

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...on the other hand, Player two knows what race Player one chose, and therefore can pick a race with an edge over it. It's almost like playing rock paper scissors already knowing which one your oponent will choose...
nlb149

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nlb149

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  IzzyNobre wrote: ...on the other hand, Player two knows what race Player one chose, and therefore can pick a race with an edge over it. It's almost like playing rock paper scissors already knowing which one your oponent will choose...


Not sure that is a great analogy because that means you have 100% chance of winning but in uniwar it just increases your chances of winning. Maybe like playing rock, paper, scissors knowing your opponent won't throw scissors.
Anonymous

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Which is why I said it's ALMOST, not EXACTLY LIKE rock-paper-scissors.
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This is IzzyNobre, by the way. I didn't realize Quick Reply would post my message as an Anonymous user.
didude

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didude

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Speak of unfair advantages, square lake has two water spots that can be accesible near the red and yellow bases that can hold up to two aquatic units (more than blue or green)
nixoncc

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nixoncc

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I have noticed it almost impossible to win a map on Rocky if you and your opponent are both Khraleans and you go first. Obviously its a race to the air - and the first player always loses...

Anyone have any insight...
Anonymous

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You don't have to build a unit on your first move.. Pass and make red go first.
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charnal

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charnal

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  Anonymous wrote: You don't have to build a unit on your first move.. Pass and make red go first.


That's actually one of the best tactics in Uniwar. Usually the first player (in two-player maps) will have a little less money than the second player. In maps where all the bases are controlled from the start* (divided equally, of course) and you can practically see your enemy, simply ending your turn and letting the other guy go first is one of the best moves you can make, unless you are pretty certain the other player is predictable. You will most likely end up with more money than player two and you will see what he does, and react accordingly. If, by any chance, they don't do anything either, than on round two when everybody just has more money, you can do it again, if you want. Perhaps it might turn into a game of "let's see how much pressure we can build before we start cranking out the big guns." That might be interesting to watch, actually.

If anybody wants to try that with me, we could be passive until round 21 before we build any troops. I invite you to invite me to a game.


*This might be unrelated, but one of the best tests of your ability to blitz and take on an enemy who's bigger than you is trying to beat mission 7 in the campaign on hard mode in under 20 rounds. This means you have to conquer the three Khralean bases in the north that are opposing your two bases in the south. The longer you wait, the more unequal it gets, especially against the cheapo khralean units they send at you. Try it. To be honest, I have beaten it on easy and normal modes, but I have not gotten it on hard mode. The challenge isn't to survive, but to actually counterattack and take over your enemy before the timer runs out. It IS allowed to conquer the three bases right on the 20th round, as the end of round 20 is when the timer rings. It IS possible, but I still have yet to get there.
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