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volf

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volf

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I dont understand why we cant make semis and finals fight to the death but then again I clearly havent given this as much thought as xavi and sims so ignore me do whatever you think best! I probably wont be in a semis or a final anytime soon anyways lol!
Das_z

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Das_z

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Another wanted to ask. Why is used in the calculation of the cost of the killed units? Is it not more correct to consider the current value of the army + cash? This largely reflects the strength of one of the players, if part of the round is to the advantage of bases.
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simsverd

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simsverd

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  Das_z wrote:Another wanted to ask. Why is used in the calculation of the cost of the killed units? Is it not more correct to consider the current value of the army + cash? This largely reflects the strength of one of the players, if part of the round is to the advantage of bases.

Why would that be more accurate with total value of units left + cash than total value of killed units? credits left can not directly equal the value of killed units or units on the board...
Could you describe a scenario where your idea would make more sence? (or more fair or accurate)

And also please remember - automatic deciding winner will never be a 100% perfect solution. We can try to get close to it, but it must be practical and scalabe - so it will always work in tourneys with many hundreds of players



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rwieczor84

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rwieczor84

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blue player always starts the game.
When game ends automatically after blues move red have one round less to play.

Game should always ends after reds move.

My idea is: After reaching timeout 0:00 for tourney round game checks:
1) If it is reds time to play he could have time to make his last move
2) If it is blues time to play it means that both players made the same number of rounds.
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simsverd

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simsverd

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  rwieczor84 wrote:blue player always starts the game.
When game ends automatically after blues move red have one round less to play.

Game should always ends after reds move.

My idea is: After reaching timeout 0:00 for tourney round game checks:
1) If it is reds time to play he could have time to make his last move
2) If it is blues time to play it means that both players made the same number of rounds.

This is a bug, and will be fixed soon - ofc it will be so that all players have same ammount of rounds taken.

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BloodyHarry

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BloodyHarry

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In my opinion, chess-like time control seems to be the best solution. For example, if a tournament should last not longer than 10 days, each player gets 120h time. Simsverd, Your argument with the different time zones doesn't convince me as both players have the same capabilities.
Das_z

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Das_z

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  simsverd wrote:
Could you describe a scenario where your idea would make more sence? (or more fair or accurate)

If I took the enemy base, after a number of moves the enemy base back yourself. In this case, my army can be stronger, but by dead units are not in my favor.
Das_z

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Das_z

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  BloodyHarry wrote:In my opinion, chess-like time control seems to be the best solution. For example, if a tournament should last not longer than 10 days, each player gets 120h time. Simsverd, Your argument with the different time zones doesn't convince me as both players have the same capabilities.


That's interesting. The question is, can it be implemented (in current uniwar)?
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simsverd

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simsverd

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  Das_z wrote:
  BloodyHarry wrote:In my opinion, chess-like time control seems to be the best solution. For example, if a tournament should last not longer than 10 days, each player gets 120h time. Simsverd, Your argument with the different time zones doesn't convince me as both players have the same capabilities.


That's interesting. The question is, can it be implemented (in current uniwar)?

BloodyHarry and Das_z: Its not that it cant be done. The question is if is a better solution to the majority of players and the "stability" of the system. In my opinion it should only be possible at the latest stages of an official tourney, but perhaps at all stages in a smaller and player arranged tourney.
But as i have said many times now.. its possible to extend the times manually as a tourney admin - so your desired effect can be done today - its more a question of the rules in each tournament (in wich the players agree to when they join).

On the issue of exploit. I agree that both parties can do that, and that is why we so far have landed on short turn times to force many moves rather have players "play for time" - autoskip can also be a possibility to discuss.

Conclusion: currently this is more about the rules (or standard rules) of the specific tourney types (championship and round robin) rather that implementing more automated solutions that you already ave the option to do as a tourney admin today.
...and for non official tourneys - the tourney admin will be "king" and can make the rules.. [DISCLAMER: it is not decided who will be tourney admin when feature is released in the client, nor what will be the limitations]

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BloodyHarry

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BloodyHarry

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1. Given the current regulation, in my opinion autoskip would be a great improvment.

2. With regard to chess-like time-management: I really cannot recognize any disadvantages. What do You mean by "stability of the system", simsverd? It's fair, same procedure for every player, fixed rules, tournaments remain automatic, no need for the admin to interfere manually (which might be problematic as it might turn out to be an advantage for one player and a disadvantage for the other).
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simsverd

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simsverd

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  BloodyHarry wrote:
What do You mean by "stability of the system", simsverd? It's fair, same procedure for every player, fixed rules, tournaments remain automatic, no need for the admin to interfere manually (which might be problematic as it might turn out to be an advantage for one player and a disadvantage for the other).

If applied on all stages of a tourney you would get different durations of each round.. and you may have situations where game goes on for months ... delaying for x-hundred ther players... There has to be a limit to how long each round can be...

You must try to see this at a system-approach.. not only what is best for 1 single game

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simsverd

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simsverd

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  BloodyHarry wrote:

2. no need for the admin to interfere manually (which might be problematic as it might turn out to be an advantage for one player and a disadvantage for the other).

This would be defined in the rules... For example: Tourney admin can prolong duration of semifinals/finals if both players agree.

Its not that i disagree with such a chess feature - my point is that it would not be such a high priority when there are other options already awailable... Tourney feature and tourney administration is still in its "infancy"

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jun 08, 2015 17:46


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BloodyHarry

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BloodyHarry

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simsverd, I disagree. There might be some misunderstanding somewhere. Let me clarify: The time budget for each player is defined per match. So the maximal time to finish a stage of a tournament is defined, too, no match can "go on for months". For me this looks compatible to the tournament system. Of course it is possible, that matches end early, but this can happen now, too. And this is no problem for the tournament "system" per se.
BloodyHarry

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BloodyHarry

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...ah, and if the time budget is used, the player has lost. no prolongation...
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volf

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volf

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How about a reserve time bank idea? Lets say you have a reserve time of like 8-12 hrs (seems fair but could be less) When the timer hits red the reserve time bank kicks in. Example: you get to the game four hrs late. Your reserve time bank has been decreased by four hrs but the remaining time can still be used if you happen to be late again. It will not add much time to each rd and will give players a bit more flexibility. The only downside will be if someone wants to stall on the last turn if they are a tiny bit ahead to secure the win. However, maybe you could decrease the reserve time in semis in finals? I also dont know how hard this would be to implement. Hopefully its possible because I think it will solve quite a few problems in tourney play
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