DIFFERENT DEFENSE VALUES and new unit type (artillery)

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Do you think this could help re-balancing?
Yes	88%	[ 7 ]
No	13%	[ 1 ]
I don't know	0%	[ 0 ]
Total Votes : 8

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May 22, 2016 12:54

Subject: DIFFERENT DEFENSE VALUES and new unit type (artillery)

Brarn Skar

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Joined: May 21, 2016,
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The current situation:
I've seen a couple of re-balance changes in units stats since I play and I know there have been more in the past. Most of the changes are very difficult to be perfectly balanced, because if you change certain unit's attack without changing it's defense it may still be unbalanced, while if you change it's defense it doesn't only change against the unit type you want to balance, but it changes for every attacker. That way changing it's defense solves the previous unbalance but creates a new one against other unit types.
Let's put an example: if you now lowered the plasma-tank defense by one to balance it against helicopter and garuda, you would create a new unbalance against tank, pinzer, boats and artillery, which would kill plasma much more easily.

My suggestion:
I've been considering this idea for quite a while now. If defense value was not a fixed one it would be easier to make re-balance changes. At first I thought units should have a different defense value against each different attacker, but after thinking more about it I concluded that it would not have a lot of sense and also it would be very difficult to program.

Then I had one good Idea: Instead of having to program different defense values, why not only add a modifier?
The current defense value would be the standard defense from now on.
Then we could add, for the different attacker types:
- special endurance: +1 defense
- neutral defense (if not specified, this is by default): +0 defense
- special weakness: -1 defense

IMO this could help re-balance fights a lot. The only thing is that it may need the creation of a new unit type (ground artillery, instead of ground heavy, for wyrm battery and walker).

Let's put a few examples of things currently happening that could be solved with this:

EXAMPLE NUMBER 1: Khralean vs khralean fights now mostly consist on swarmer and garuda, with minor appearances of other units.
Suggested changes for that specific problem: Pinzer aerial attack +1 & special weakness modifier (def. -1) against aerials.
EXAMPLE NUMBER 2: Marauders being in complete disadvantage against other ground heavies except for eclipse. Also eclipse being useless against other heavies.
Suggested changes for that specific problem: marauder could have special endurance (def. +1) against ground heavy, no changes in attack. Eclipse +1 attack against ground heav

This message was edited 10 times. Last update was at May 22, 2016 16:35

May 22, 2016 13:17

Subject: Continuation of the idea

Brarn Skar

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Joined: May 21, 2016,
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Apparently I reached the maximum amount of characters allowed, but I wanted to put a couple more of examples:

EXAMPLE NUMBER 3: Walls of plasma-tanks with eclipse and walker behind, very difficult to pierce for ground units and nearly impossible for aerials:
Suggested changes: Plasma-tank special weakness (-1 defense) against aerials.
EXAMPLE NUMBER 4: Helicopter, Garuda and Swarmer, some of the most capable units of attacking a Wyrm, suffering the same damage dealt or more
Suggested changes: Wyrm special weakness (-1 defense) against aerials.

PLEASE, NOTICE THAT: All of those are just examples of re-balancings that could be made, but are not being actually suggested in this poll, the only think we are debating here is the existence of the new defensive special modifiers and the new unit type "ground artillery" for wyrm, walker and battery.

Clarifying what I suggested of a new unit type, ground artillery:
This is a necessary addition to the idea to keep the balance if the new special defensive modifiers are included into the game. In any case, even if the main idea is not accepted, this could be very good for balancing anyway.
For this to be possible, as wyrm, battery and walker would be one new type of unit, we need to specify that their current attack and defense values will be (subject to future changes) the same. Also every unit in the game will have a new attack value against ground artillery units that will be, at the beginning, the same as it currently is against ground heavies (subject to future changes). That way we keep the same stats and balance for artilleries as we have right now, but we win the possibility of re-balancing in the near future. In addition, the creation of this unit type will allow to re-balance normal ground heavies between them without creating any changes in the balance against artilleries. PS: buried underlings and cyber-underlings would still be smashed and suffer 1 damage when a ground artillery steps on them.

Together with ground artillery, we could also consider ground semi-heavy: The changes would be exactly as ground artillery's, but it would affect this time the marauder, speeder and (maybe) eclipse. They would still smash underling and cyber-underling while buried. This one option could also be useful, but it is, however, not really necessary to complete the main idea of the thread.

This message was edited 16 times. Last update was at May 22, 2016 16:33

May 25, 2016 22:23

Subject: Re:DIFFERENT DEFENSE VALUES and new unit type (artillery)

Michaelrn

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Joined: Feb 16, 2016,
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Special endurance and weakness indeed seems to be a good ideia to help the balancing. I also like the idea of the ground semi-heavy (or ground medium as it was suggested before), but I am not sure about the artillery type. I agree that it can be an additional tool to help balancing, but it seems like an weird unit type to me.

May 27, 2016 12:27

Subject: Re:DIFFERENT DEFENSE VALUES and new unit type (artillery)

Apercent

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Joined: Sep 08, 2015,
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I like it.

May 27, 2016 13:02

Subject: Re:DIFFERENT DEFENSE VALUES and new unit type (artillery)

Edisontrent7

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Joined: May 04, 2016,
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In that situation there would need to be more balancing with the different attack strengths and very few units for each type: One Ground light, ground medium, ground heavy, and artillery. or ess with some races

Since when did we have Racecars with machine guns?

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