thethanx
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thethanx
Messages: 62,
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Lion, I'll gladly set up a game or two, however, just to clarify, are we specifically talking about only 2 player maps? I feel as though it can make a difference as unrated larger maps can give khrals more of an advantage... Hey if nothing else I'll learn how to always beat khrals with saps right?
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lion3
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lion3
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thethanx wrote: Lion, I'll gladly set up a game or two, however, just to clarify, are we specifically talking about only 2 player maps? I feel as though it can make a difference as unrated larger maps can give khrals more of an advantage... Hey if nothing else I'll learn how to always beat khrals with saps right?
I dont see why larger maps would make a difference here so I am happy to play them as well.
However, my comment was only about non-naval maps.
I dont play naval maps and dont know if or how having ships changes the final outcome.
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dr. pepper
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dr. pepper
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I definitely do not think this is the case, but I do not have the skill with Khraleans to prove you wrong. Are you saying that you always beat Khrals? When was the last time you lost to them?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jul 06, 2010 17:17
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lion3
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lion3
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dr. pepper wrote: I definitely do not think this is the case, but I do not have the skill with Khraleans to prove you wrong. Are you saying that you always beat Khrals? When was the last time you lost to them?
Thats exactly what I am saying. I cannot even remember the last time I lost a game to Khrals.
In the past month I played about 60 games and won 59 of them. In most of the games I was playing Saps vs. Khrals. My ranking went from 1500 to almost 2300 in one month.
In my other account (lion37), it a similar story.
Not bragging, just stating the facts.
If any Khral player out there thinks he can beat Saps, please send me a game invite and prove me wrong.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jul 07, 2010 00:50
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Nicko
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Nicko
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Not bragging for sure, methinks you're an excellent sapien player for sure, congrqts on that. I say you need to find also a top notch khral player, if that didn't happen already, but to be on equal grounds.
In any case I got my ass whooped, but I'm far from a very good player, just decent.
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"I hate the world's population, it's too large and getting larger. People need to slow down on the sex!"
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lion3
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lion3
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Since creating this thread, I have had about 20 challenges where other players tried to beat me with them as Khrals and me as Saps. So far I have won every singe challenge on every map.
My playbook is simple:
1) Spam marines + Heli's
2) Move marines to mountains or forests whenever possible.
3) Strike with Heli's and then hide them behind marines.
4) Occasionally use Marauders to take out Wyrms.
5) Use 5 heli's in one turn to kill any Pinzers that show up.
I can never "prove" that Saps always beat Khrals, since its always possible that some great Khral player will find a way to win. However, I think I have shown ample evidence that there is a game imbalance that should be fixed.
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lion3
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lion3
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So, how do we fix the game balance?
My best idea is that Swarmer Arial attack should be increased from 3 to 4.
This will have no impact on Khral vs. Titan battles since Titans have no flying units.
This will also (obviously) have no impact on Sap vs. Titan battles which are already fairly well balanced.
It will, give the Khral player a better weapon against the Sap strategy of spamming Marines + Heli's since now the swarmer will be able to hurt both units.
Will this impact Khral vs. Khral battles? Possibly yes, since we will see more Swarmers and less Garudas in such battles. But I don't think it will dramatically change those battles.
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Sphink
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Sphink
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Actually I believe that the Arial damage for swarmers was reduced to prevent "swarmer wars" some time back. I think it would have a major impact on Khral vs. Khral due to the fact that khral's army is for the most part arial based. I think perhaps giving the underling 2-3 arial attack might help? I don't know that's just a guess. Since marines have strong anti-air I think it would help make heli's and marines a little less powerfull vs khral. And on a side note, I use mostly heli's and marines vs sapians too. So maybe the marines are a little over powered.
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Good luck, Have fun!
My biased opinions are open-minded.
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nfong
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nfong
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Sphink wrote: So maybe the marines are a little over powered.
I agree with sphink here...I just played a Green Valley game, with me as krahls and my opponent as sapiens.
I caught both of the middle bases, so I had 4 bases and my opponent had 2. I knew that eventually I was going to win, because I was getting 200 more credits every turn...but my opponent put up a good fight spamming marines.
His marines were ganging up on my garudas to do 7 damage!
but eventually once I made a good strong wall I made the infectors and then the battle was over... 
Anyways what I'm trying to say is that I think a marine's aerial attack is too high...but I guess that's to offset the fact that they have no special ability.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at Jul 18, 2010 15:59
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When life gives you lemons...
"TAKE YOUR DAMN LEMONS BACK, LIFE. I DON'T WANT YOUR STINKIN' LEMONS." |
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lion3
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lion3
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Ok after playing more games against top Khral players, I was beaten twice (with me playing Saps).
So I guess the answer to my question is no, Saps dont always beat Khrals.
I therefore withdraw my suggestion to increase the Swarmer air attack.
However, I would still point out the following:
1) Khral payers only beat me on maps with no mountains and no forests (or no usable mountains & forests) so the Sap marine was not nearly as useful.
2) The games were very close.
3) I did win a re-match with one of the Khral players.
4) I was not playing my best.
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MasonC
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MasonC
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I think that maybe they should make the air units cost a bit more and make them stronger
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MasonC
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MasonC
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Now I think about it maybe they should make heli cost 450 and lower there power
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Paul5678
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Paul5678
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lion3 wrote: Ok after playing more games against top Khral players, I was beaten twice (with me playing Saps).
Were you including my game in your stats here? It was one of the most challenging UniWar games I've played, and I was really hoping to finish it. (After 12 rounds, it was really starting to get interesting. I thought I had a slight edge and was going to win... but then again, I'm an optimist.)
Anyway, thanks for suggesting that experiment.
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Hachiman
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Hachiman
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lion3 wrote: Ok after playing more games against top Khral players, I was beaten twice (with me playing Saps).
So I guess the answer to my question is no, Saps dont always beat Khrals.
I therefore withdraw my suggestion to increase the Swarmer air attack.
However, I would still point out the following:
1) Khral payers only beat me on maps with no mountains and no forests (or no usable mountains & forests) so the Sap marine was not nearly as useful.
2) The games were very close.
3) I did win a re-match with one of the Khral players.
4) I was not playing my best.
There are some maps where Khrals beat saps - particularly where there are lots of marshes, which lowers a Marine's efficiency vs air units.
I'm not sure what the answer is, but it isn't raising the Swarmer air attack. This was lowered not that long ago because if you raise it, Swarmers become quite O/P when spammed continuously.
Perhaps raising the Pinzers air attack slightly, to make them a better blocker? Then again this was raised then quickly lowered too.
How about lowering the Heli's air attack? Or raising the Wyrms? Or (as already suggested) giving the Underling a small air attack. I think the last is probably the best option... makes them somewhat useful in Khral vs Sap matches, esp in good Terrain.
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nfong
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nfong
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Lowering the heli's air attack is probably not a good idea...a heli's air attack is already the same as a garuda's!
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When life gives you lemons...
"TAKE YOUR DAMN LEMONS BACK, LIFE. I DON'T WANT YOUR STINKIN' LEMONS." |
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